OT: Thinking about design

[Pat]

A couple of days ago the speedo cable on my motorcycle came undone up
at the speedo end. It just came undone and pulled out of the
speedo.

Now, on most bikes it's NBD, but I have an older, full-dress, touring
bike with complete flairings and more trim than you can imagine.
Removing the flairing is sometimes the hardest (and most time
consuming) part of the job.

After removing the flairing near where the gas tank is (okay, the gas
tank is actually under the seat, but it where it is on other bikes)
and the left-hand part of the dash, I couldn't get into the instrument
cluster -- let alone into the back of it.

I then started taking the windshield assembly off to get the headlight
out. By removing the headline and the left blinker assembly, I could
sort of get into the area. At least I could feel the threads on the
back of the speedo. But there was no way to get my hands and the
cable up in there, get things properly aligned, and then spin on the
cable.

I finally got the spindle up in where it belonged, held it in place
through the blinker hole, and was able to spin the exterior of the
cable and get it to screw on.

I got me thinking, what God-forsaken person designed this. It takes
an hour to figure out how the make the repair and how to get into the
area I wanted to get into. Okay, it's not architecture, but it is
engineering and design. Grrrrrrrr.

2.5 hours to spin on the end of a speed cable. Ugh.

[Ken S. Tucker]

Post by Pat
A couple of days ago the speedo cable on my motorcycle came undone up
at the speedo end. It just came undone and pulled out of the
speedo.
Now, on most bikes it's NBD, but I have an older, full-dress, touring
bike with complete flairings and more trim than you can imagine.
Removing the flairing is sometimes the hardest (and most time
consuming) part of the job.
After removing the flairing near where the gas tank is (okay, the gas
tank is actually under the seat, but it where it is on other bikes)
and the left-hand part of the dash, I couldn't get into the instrument
cluster -- let alone into the back of it.
I then started taking the windshield assembly off to get the headlight
out. By removing the headline and the left blinker assembly, I could
sort of get into the area. At least I could feel the threads on the
back of the speedo. But there was no way to get my hands and the
cable up in there, get things properly aligned, and then spin on the
cable.
I finally got the spindle up in where it belonged, held it in place
through the blinker hole, and was able to spin the exterior of the
cable and get it to screw on.
I got me thinking, what God-forsaken person designed this. It takes
an hour to figure out how the make the repair and how to get into the
area I wanted to get into. Okay, it's not architecture, but it is
engineering and design. Grrrrrrrr.
2.5 hours to spin on the end of a speed cable. Ugh.

I hear ya! But if they were too easy to disconnect,
you'd be complaining someone stoled it :-).

But it really is topical. Architecture has evolved fairly
well to keep things serviceable. In this place we
designed we kept "serviceability access" in priority
above appearance. We had a serious challenge as
we have no basement, not even crawl space, so
removeable panels were used.
Ken

[RicodJour]

Post by Ken S. Tucker
Architecture has evolved fairly
well to keep things serviceable. In this place we
designed we kept "serviceability access" in priority
above appearance. We had a serious challenge as
we have no basement, not even crawl space, so
removeable panels were used.

Hey Ken. Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for
your house? They're really clever about packing in storage and
keeping things stowed away. You should also look at the old style
chest tool boxes with the movable tills.

R

[Ken S. Tucker]

Post by RicodJour

Post by Ken S. Tucker
Architecture has evolved fairly
well to keep things serviceable. In this place we
designed we kept "serviceability access" in priority
above appearance. We had a serious challenge as
we have no basement, not even crawl space, so
removeable panels were used.

Hey Ken. Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for
your house? They're really clever about packing in storage and
keeping things stowed away. You should also look at the old style
chest tool boxes with the movable tills.
R

Yup, we studied RV's.
As much as possible we rely on totes, even for
drawers. We have an 8x12 + 4x8 outbuilding
for storage that is slowly accumulating stuff to
my chagin.
My/our problem is we start storing stuff that
we *might* use, wife and I are both guilty.

In the last place we redid the attached garage
then filled it up. Then we built a 12x24 storage
room with an attached 24x16 and filled that up.
Here's pix of that going up,
http://www.trak4.com/shed/index.html
It wasn't easy to get rid of all that good junk
when we "bit the bullet" and downsized.
We filled up a few friends extra space :-).
Ken

[Warm Worm]

Post by RicodJour
Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for
your house? They're really clever about packing in storage and
keeping things stowed away.

Boat-design as inspiration for small house design crossed my mind as
well. I wonder if architecture schools teach something of it.

[RicodJour]

 > Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for

your house?  They're really clever about packing in storage and
keeping things stowed away.  

Boat-design as inspiration for small house design crossed my mind as
well. I wonder if architecture schools teach something of it.

Hell, most of them don't even reference working buildings for design.

I think Ken should have looked at some teardrop trailers for his house
design.
Poke around this page and you'll see what I mean:
http://teardrop.blogicalthoughts.com/td_2nditg.html

A teardrop design has all sorts of benefits in Ken's situation. It is
DIY friendly, it has a cool sloping roof that sheds snow and water.
It's basically made for cooking/eating and lying down - Ken's favorite
activities. It has a large opening rear hatch - perfect for after the
Spring thaw when the Grizzly bears have left the area. It rolls so he
can move it around. He could build several of them for when guests
and family visit and when he is in the dog house. He could circle the
wagons when the restless natives are particularly restless. It's
freaking aluminum and wood and how cool is that?!

R

[Pat]

Post by RicodJour

Post by Warm Worm

Post by RicodJour
Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for
your house? They're really clever about packing in storage and
keeping things stowed away.

Boat-design as inspiration for small house design crossed my mind as
well. I wonder if architecture schools teach something of it.

Hell, most of them don't even reference working buildings for design.
I think Ken should have looked at some teardrop trailers for his house
design.
Poke around this page and you'll see what I mean:http://teardrop.blogicalthoughts.com/td_2nditg.html
A teardrop design has all sorts of benefits in Ken's situation. It is
DIY friendly, it has a cool sloping roof that sheds snow and water.
It's basically made for cooking/eating and lying down - Ken's favorite
activities. It has a large opening rear hatch - perfect for after the
Spring thaw when the Grizzly bears have left the area. It rolls so he
can move it around. He could build several of them for when guests
and family visit and when he is in the dog house. He could circle the
wagons when the restless natives are particularly restless. It's
freaking aluminum and wood and how cool is that?!
R

And they're collectable. Don't forget that. It could spawn a whole
new hobby.

[Martin Clark]

Post by Pat

Post by RicodJour

Post by Warm Worm

Post by RicodJour
Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for
your house? They're really clever about packing in storage and
keeping things stowed away.

Boat-design as inspiration for small house design crossed my mind
as well. I wonder if architecture schools teach something of it.

Hell, most of them don't even reference working buildings for design.
I think Ken should have looked at some teardrop trailers for his
house design.
Poke around this page and you'll see what I
mean:http://teardrop.blogicalthoughts.com/td_2nditg.html
A teardrop design has all sorts of benefits in Ken's situation. It
is DIY friendly, it has a cool sloping roof that sheds snow and
water. It's basically made for cooking/eating and lying down - Ken's
favorite activities. It has a large opening rear hatch - perfect for
after the Spring thaw when the Grizzly bears have left the area. It
rolls so he can move it around. He could build several of them for
when guests and family visit and when he is in the dog house. He
could circle the wagons when the restless natives are particularly
restless. It's freaking aluminum and wood and how cool is that?!
R

And they're collectable. Don't forget that. It could spawn a whole
new hobby.

And you could probably tow one behind a compressed-air car or tuktuk
(thinking ahead beyond peak oil?)

[++]

Post by RicodJour

Post by Warm Worm

Post by RicodJour
Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for
your house? They're really clever about packing in storage and
keeping things stowed away.

Boat-design as inspiration for small house design crossed my mind as
well. I wonder if architecture schools teach something of it.

Hell, most of them don't even reference working buildings for design.
I think Ken should have looked at some teardrop trailers for his house
design.
http://teardrop.blogicalthoughts.com/td_2nditg.html
A teardrop design has all sorts of benefits in Ken's situation. It is
DIY friendly, it has a cool sloping roof that sheds snow and water.
It's basically made for cooking/eating and lying down - Ken's favorite
activities. It has a large opening rear hatch - perfect for after the
Spring thaw when the Grizzly bears have left the area. It rolls so he
can move it around. He could build several of them for when guests
and family visit and when he is in the dog house. He could circle the
wagons when the restless natives are particularly restless. It's
freaking aluminum and wood and how cool is that?!
R

There are buildiings that take their inspiration from boats or ships.
Here is one of the most famous, the Balat [name of a district] Ahrida
Synagogue in Istanbul, for which see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahrida_Synagogue_of_Istanbul
*
The bema is in the shape of a ship and other parts of the interior are
reflective
*

[Ken S. Tucker]

Post by RicodJour

Post by Warm Worm

Post by RicodJour
Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for
your house? They're really clever about packing in storage and
keeping things stowed away.

Boat-design as inspiration for small house design crossed my mind as
well. I wonder if architecture schools teach something of it.

Hell, most of them don't even reference working buildings for design.
I think Ken should have looked at some teardrop trailers for his house
design.
Poke around this page and you'll see what I mean:http://teardrop.blogicalthoughts.com/td_2nditg.html
A teardrop design has all sorts of benefits in Ken's situation. It is
DIY friendly, it has a cool sloping roof that sheds snow and water.
It's basically made for cooking/eating and lying down - Ken's favorite
activities. It has a large opening rear hatch - perfect for after the
Spring thaw when the Grizzly bears have left the area. It rolls so he
can move it around. He could build several of them for when guests
and family visit and when he is in the dog house. He could circle the
wagons when the restless natives are particularly restless. It's
freaking aluminum and wood and how cool is that?!
R

Super cool, nice link. Those trailers look practical
for camping. We thought of building a camper,
but wife bought a Gran Caravan instead, that we'll
use.

Funny story...
http://www.austriantimes.at/index.php?id=8072
Ken

[Kris Krieger]

Post by RicodJour

 > Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for

your house?  They're really clever about packing in storage and
keeping things stowed away.  

Boat-design as inspiration for small house design crossed my mind as
well. I wonder if architecture schools teach something of it.

Hell, most of them don't even reference working buildings for design.
I think Ken should have looked at some teardrop trailers for his house
design.
http://teardrop.blogicalthoughts.com/td_2nditg.html
A teardrop design has all sorts of benefits in Ken's situation. It is
DIY friendly, it has a cool sloping roof that sheds snow and water.
It's basically made for cooking/eating and lying down - Ken's favorite
activities. It has a large opening rear hatch - perfect for after the
Spring thaw when the Grizzly bears have left the area. It rolls so he
can move it around. He could build several of them for when guests
and family visit and when he is in the dog house. He could circle the
wagons when the restless natives are particularly restless. It's
freaking aluminum and wood and how cool is that?!
R

Does anyone make those anymore?

Can a small car pull one?

I'd thought soemthing like that would be a great way to camp, a.k.a. avoid
hotel problems and sleep where you know how clean the sheets are - I'm not
at all up for sleeping ont he ground in a flimsy tent, but after seing some
of these teardrop trailers on an RV show, I thought it'd be a great way to
sleep up off the ground in a fairly sturdy structure, *but* without having
to spend a fortune on some super-techno monster that you need a 3-ton truck
to haul around.

The only drawback is they're too small to have a little shower/potty
inside. Or are they...? I don't know anything about them, really. I like
the idea of being able to bring your bed and a small kitchen along with
you, so you don't have to stay in hotels and eat out all the time, btu I'd
also liek a small shower/toilet.

What I saw that I really liked was the compact units tat are now made for
long-haul truckers. I wouldn't want to lve in one permanently (I have too
many hobbies to fit into the unit), but IMO, it'd make a great little
camper.


- Kris

[RicodJour]

Post by RicodJour

 > Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for

your house?  They're really clever about packing in storage and
keeping things stowed away.  

Boat-design as inspiration for small house design crossed my mind as
well. I wonder if architecture schools teach something of it.

Hell, most of them don't even reference working buildings for design.
I think Ken should have looked at some teardrop trailers for his house
design.
http://teardrop.blogicalthoughts.com/td_2nditg.html
A teardrop design has all sorts of benefits in Ken's situation.  It is
DIY friendly, it has a cool sloping roof that sheds snow and water.
It's basically made for cooking/eating and lying down - Ken's favorite
activities.  It has a large opening rear hatch - perfect for after the
Spring thaw when the Grizzly bears have left the area.  It rolls so he
can move it around.  He could build several of them for when guests
and family visit and when he is in the dog house.  He could circle the
wagons when the restless natives are particularly restless.  It's
freaking aluminum and wood and how cool is that?!
R

Does anyone make those anymore?  
Can a small car pull one?
I'd thought soemthing like that would be a great way to camp, a.k.a. avoid
hotel problems and sleep where you know how clean the sheets are - I'm not
at all up for sleeping ont he ground in a flimsy tent, but after seing some
of these teardrop trailers on an RV show, I thought it'd be a great way to
sleep up off the ground in a fairly sturdy structure, *but* without having
to spend a fortune on some super-techno monster that you need a 3-ton truck
to haul around.
The only drawback is they're too small to have a little shower/potty
inside.  Or are they...?  I don't know anything about them, really.  I like
the idea of being able to bring your bed and a small kitchen along with
you, so you don't have to stay in hotels and eat out all the time, btu I'd
also liek a small shower/toilet.
What I saw that I really liked was the compact units tat are now made for
long-haul truckers.  I wouldn't want to lve in one permanently (I have too
many hobbies to fit into the unit), but IMO, it'd make a great little
camper.

People have pulled the things with their Harleys. Pretty much any car
can pull a teardrop.

Some of them have a porta potty and it wouldn't be too much work to
rig up a shower curtain hanging from the rear hatch.

Here's one guy that hooked up a car engine heated shower:
http://www.nicksteardrop.com/spamboree5.htm

Store-bought version that takes a car with a little more oomph:
http://www.roamingtimes.com/rvreports/tab-teardrop-trailer.aspx

And here's where you can ask specific questions and say "wow" alot:
http://www.mikenchell.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5978&start=0&sid=15ea6f759d5a8af8d20730e7485c5e28

R

[Kris Krieger]

RicodJour <***@worldemail.com> wrote in news:579112c7-3b2f-4f5c-915d-***@a70g2000hsh.googlegroups.com:

[snip]

Post by RicodJour
People have pulled the things with their Harleys. Pretty much any car
can pull a teardrop.
Some of them have a porta potty and it wouldn't be too much work to
rig up a shower curtain hanging from the rear hatch.
http://www.nicksteardrop.com/spamboree5.htm
http://www.roamingtimes.com/rvreports/tab-teardrop-trailer.aspx
http://www.mikenchell.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5978&start=0&sid=15ea6f7
59d5a8af8d20730e7485c5e28
R

Hey, thanks for the links!

I just started thinking about this recently as a possible way of taking
vacations after retirement - my idea of vcation being "let's explore teh
Grand Canyon" as opposed to "let's go spend wads of $$ gambling and
watching shows and going to overpriced bars".

Hmmm, who was it who'd posted pics here, I guess about a year ago, that
he'd taken in Nevada, takin a day trip while the rest fo the family went to
Las Vegas? That's the sort of thing I mean. A mini-trailer would be great
for that.

The last link suggested a sit-down shower/bath, which would work fine for
me. Main thing is just to be able to pour some hot water over myself,
slather on the Cetaphil, and another pour to rinse off - nothing too fancy.
The car-engine-heated water was clever ;)


I followed some of the links and it's interesting to see all teh plans for
building one's own. I'll have to look to see whetehr tehre are
instructions for fiberglass ones - that should make for a more lightweight
item, yet still sturdy enough.


Anyway, interesting links, and inspirations for small-scale living :)

- Kris

[RicodJour]

Post by Kris Krieger
The only drawback is they're too small to have a little shower/potty
inside.  Or are they...?  I don't know anything about them, really.  I like
the idea of being able to bring your bed and a small kitchen along with
you, so you don't have to stay in hotels and eat out all the time, btu I'd
also liek a small shower/toilet.

Another possibility:
http://www.puxtradingpost.com/product_info.php?cPath=43_74&products_id=230

R

[Kris Krieger]

Post by Kris Krieger
The only drawback is they're too small to have a little shower/potty
inside.  Or are they...?  I don't know anything about them, really.

 I like

Post by Kris Krieger
the idea of being able to bring your bed and a small kitchen along with
you, so you don't have to stay in hotels and eat out all the time, btu I'

d

Post by Kris Krieger
also liek a small shower/toilet.

http://www.puxtradingpost.com/product_info.php?cPath=43_74&products_id=230
R

Also an intresting site :)

THanks!

- Kris

[Ken S. Tucker]

Post by Kris Krieger

Post by RicodJour

Post by Warm Worm

Post by RicodJour
Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for
your house? They're really clever about packing in storage and
keeping things stowed away.

Boat-design as inspiration for small house design crossed my mind as
well. I wonder if architecture schools teach something of it.

Hell, most of them don't even reference working buildings for design.
I think Ken should have looked at some teardrop trailers for his house
design.
http://teardrop.blogicalthoughts.com/td_2nditg.html
A teardrop design has all sorts of benefits in Ken's situation. It is
DIY friendly, it has a cool sloping roof that sheds snow and water.
It's basically made for cooking/eating and lying down - Ken's favorite
activities. It has a large opening rear hatch - perfect for after the
Spring thaw when the Grizzly bears have left the area. It rolls so he
can move it around. He could build several of them for when guests
and family visit and when he is in the dog house. He could circle the
wagons when the restless natives are particularly restless. It's
freaking aluminum and wood and how cool is that?!
R

Does anyone make those anymore?
Can a small car pull one?
I'd thought soemthing like that would be a great way to camp, a.k.a. avoid
hotel problems and sleep where you know how clean the sheets are - I'm not
at all up for sleeping ont he ground in a flimsy tent, but after seing some
of these teardrop trailers on an RV show, I thought it'd be a great way to
sleep up off the ground in a fairly sturdy structure, *but* without having
to spend a fortune on some super-techno monster that you need a 3-ton truck
to haul around.
The only drawback is they're too small to have a little shower/potty
inside. Or are they...? I don't know anything about them, really. I like
the idea of being able to bring your bed and a small kitchen along with
you, so you don't have to stay in hotels and eat out all the time, btu I'd
also liek a small shower/toilet.
What I saw that I really liked was the compact units tat are now made for
long-haul truckers. I wouldn't want to lve in one permanently (I have too
many hobbies to fit into the unit), but IMO, it'd make a great little
camper.
- Kris

We love camping, did 3 weeks sleeping in a Chevy
Cavalier with a car-top. For rainy days we had cards
and Monopoly to play, we also had a TV with a cute
deployable antenna, that was our longest. We've
gone around NA a few times.
For ventilation we use fine screening magnetically
attached over the open windows.
Always kept some SPAM and Ham in a can, other-
wise we et left-over KFC, or made a sandwich, if the
weather was hard.
Otherwise, out goes the wittle BBQ and toss on a
bit meat and stuff...sit out and if you plan-plan well,
you have a state park to yourself with an excellent
view, that's a craft, though meeting people is almost
always a pleasure.
We sleep in a hard camper cuz of Lions & Tigers &
Bears (oh my), often off road, in desolate areas.
Ken

[Kris Krieger]

Post by Ken S. Tucker

Post by Kris Krieger

Post by RicodJour

Post by Warm Worm

Post by RicodJour
Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for
your house? They're really clever about packing in storage and
keeping things stowed away.

Boat-design as inspiration for small house design crossed my mind as
well. I wonder if architecture schools teach something of it.

Hell, most of them don't even reference working buildings for design.
I think Ken should have looked at some teardrop trailers for his
house design.
http://teardrop.blogicalthoughts.com/td_2nditg.html
A teardrop design has all sorts of benefits in Ken's situation. It
is DIY friendly, it has a cool sloping roof that sheds snow and
water. It's basically made for cooking/eating and lying down - Ken's
favorite activities. It has a large opening rear hatch - perfect for
after the Spring thaw when the Grizzly bears have left the area. It
rolls so he can move it around. He could build several of them for
when guests and family visit and when he is in the dog house. He
could circle the wagons when the restless natives are particularly
restless. It's freaking aluminum and wood and how cool is that?!
R

Does anyone make those anymore?
Can a small car pull one?
I'd thought soemthing like that would be a great way to camp, a.k.a.
avoid hotel problems and sleep where you know how clean the sheets are
- I'm not at all up for sleeping ont he ground in a flimsy tent, but
after seing some of these teardrop trailers on an RV show, I thought
it'd be a great way to sleep up off the ground in a fairly sturdy
structure, *but* without having to spend a fortune on some super-techno
monster that you need a 3-ton truck to haul around.
The only drawback is they're too small to have a little shower/potty
inside. Or are they...? I don't know anything about them, really. I
like the idea of being able to bring your bed and a small kitchen along
with you, so you don't have to stay in hotels and eat out all the time,
btu I'd also liek a small shower/toilet.
What I saw that I really liked was the compact units tat are now made
for long-haul truckers. I wouldn't want to lve in one permanently (I
have too many hobbies to fit into the unit), but IMO, it'd make a great
little camper.
- Kris

We love camping, did 3 weeks sleeping in a Chevy
Cavalier with a car-top.

I thought those are sedans...?

Post by Ken S. Tucker
For rainy days we had cards
and Monopoly to play, we also had a TV with a cute
deployable antenna, that was our longest. We've
gone around NA a few times.
For ventilation we use fine screening magnetically
attached over the open windows.

There is some very fine-mesh stuff available these days :)

Post by Ken S. Tucker
Always kept some SPAM and Ham in a can, other-
wise we et left-over KFC, or made a sandwich, if the
weather was hard.
Otherwise, out goes the wittle BBQ and toss on a
bit meat and stuff...sit out and if you plan-plan well,
you have a state park to yourself with an excellent
view, that's a craft, though meeting people is almost
always a pleasure.

Yeah, it'd be nice to have the choice ;) .

Post by Ken S. Tucker
We sleep in a hard camper cuz of Lions & Tigers &
Bears (oh my), often off road, in desolate areas.
Ken

My parents had one of those old VW Van campers. Now that was a neat littel
thing. Main problem was that it was too narrow for the height, making it
top-heavy. But I held onto the idea of something compact.

My aunt has some sort of mega-beast, with all of those motorized pop-outs,
that requires a mega-truck to pull it, so now they can't aford to go
anywhere becasue of the diesel prices. THat's not even remotely what I'm
interested in.

I'm actually not a camper - I'm allergic to too many things :p to have
gotten into it. But I'm thinking about something that'd basically be a
place to sleep, while travelling to see various places, like the Grand
Canyon or other national parks, monuments, and so on. I also like the idea
of being able to prepare my own meals, given all the fat and salt and MSG
and whatever that restaurant food is likely to have. I know, it sounds
geeky, but there it is. At the same time, if you have a self-contained
unit, you're less confined to specific geographical areas.


Anyhoo, some of those links Rico provided have furtehr links to plans and
so on, so I'll have to give some thought to "living small" ;)

- Kris

[Ken S. Tucker]

Post by Kris Krieger

Post by Ken S. Tucker

Post by Kris Krieger

Post by RicodJour

Post by Warm Worm

Post by RicodJour
Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for
your house? They're really clever about packing in storage and
keeping things stowed away.

Boat-design as inspiration for small house design crossed my mind as
well. I wonder if architecture schools teach something of it.

Hell, most of them don't even reference working buildings for design.
I think Ken should have looked at some teardrop trailers for his
house design.
http://teardrop.blogicalthoughts.com/td_2nditg.html
A teardrop design has all sorts of benefits in Ken's situation. It
is DIY friendly, it has a cool sloping roof that sheds snow and
water. It's basically made for cooking/eating and lying down - Ken's
favorite activities. It has a large opening rear hatch - perfect for
after the Spring thaw when the Grizzly bears have left the area. It
rolls so he can move it around. He could build several of them for
when guests and family visit and when he is in the dog house. He
could circle the wagons when the restless natives are particularly
restless. It's freaking aluminum and wood and how cool is that?!
R

Does anyone make those anymore?
Can a small car pull one?
I'd thought soemthing like that would be a great way to camp, a.k.a.
avoid hotel problems and sleep where you know how clean the sheets are
- I'm not at all up for sleeping ont he ground in a flimsy tent, but
after seing some of these teardrop trailers on an RV show, I thought
it'd be a great way to sleep up off the ground in a fairly sturdy
structure, *but* without having to spend a fortune on some super-techno
monster that you need a 3-ton truck to haul around.
The only drawback is they're too small to have a little shower/potty
inside. Or are they...? I don't know anything about them, really. I
like the idea of being able to bring your bed and a small kitchen along
with you, so you don't have to stay in hotels and eat out all the time,
btu I'd also liek a small shower/toilet.
What I saw that I really liked was the compact units tat are now made
for long-haul truckers. I wouldn't want to lve in one permanently (I
have too many hobbies to fit into the unit), but IMO, it'd make a great
little camper.
- Kris

We love camping, did 3 weeks sleeping in a Chevy
Cavalier with a car-top.

I thought those are sedans...?

1993 wagon.

Post by Kris Krieger

Post by Ken S. Tucker
For rainy days we had cards
and Monopoly to play, we also had a TV with a cute
deployable antenna, that was our longest. We've
gone around NA a few times.
For ventilation we use fine screening magnetically
attached over the open windows.

There is some very fine-mesh stuff available these days :)

Post by Ken S. Tucker
Always kept some SPAM and Ham in a can, other-
wise we et left-over KFC, or made a sandwich, if the
weather was hard.
Otherwise, out goes the wittle BBQ and toss on a
bit meat and stuff...sit out and if you plan-plan well,
you have a state park to yourself with an excellent
view, that's a craft, though meeting people is almost
always a pleasure.

Yeah, it'd be nice to have the choice ;) .

Post by Ken S. Tucker
We sleep in a hard camper cuz of Lions & Tigers &
Bears (oh my), often off road, in desolate areas.
Ken

My parents had one of those old VW Van campers. Now that was a neat littel
thing. Main problem was that it was too narrow for the height, making it
top-heavy. But I held onto the idea of something compact.
My aunt has some sort of mega-beast, with all of those motorized pop-outs,
that requires a mega-truck to pull it, so now they can't aford to go
anywhere becasue of the diesel prices. THat's not even remotely what I'm
interested in.
I'm actually not a camper - I'm allergic to too many things :p to have
gotten into it. But I'm thinking about something that'd basically be a
place to sleep, while travelling to see various places, like the Grand
Canyon or other national parks, monuments, and so on. I also like the idea
of being able to prepare my own meals, given all the fat and salt and MSG
and whatever that restaurant food is likely to have. I know, it sounds
geeky, but there it is. At the same time, if you have a self-contained
unit, you're less confined to specific geographical areas.
Anyhoo, some of those links Rico provided have furtehr links to plans and
so on, so I'll have to give some thought to "living small" ;)
- Kris

We did a practice mission in the backyard, setting
up the tarp on the car allocating suitcases etc.
We wanted something that could do 70-80 mph,
and self contained, it worked well.
Ken

[RicodJour]

Post by Kris Krieger
Anyhoo, some of those links Rico provided have furtehr links to plans and
so on, so I'll have to give some thought to "living small" ;)

Think of it more as "living large on a small scale".

R

[Kris Krieger]

Post by RicodJour

Post by Kris Krieger
Anyhoo, some of those links Rico provided have furtehr links to plans and
so on, so I'll have to give some thought to "living small" ;)

Think of it more as "living large on a small scale".
R

THe interesting thing is how little useable room on egains with increased
square footage. The rental house here was 2500 sq ft, and had a *huge*
amount of built-in storage. THis place is 3200 sq ft, about the same closet
space, less kitchen cabinet space, and little additional storage (soem
shelves in the laundry room is the extent of it). The otehr, and even
stupider, thing is that the entire area under the stairs is simply walled off
- no access, no storage. It's goofy.

If I can ever have a place custom-designed, I want to be sure it uincludes
lots of built-in storage. I'd ratherput stuff into a cabinet or closet or
whatever, and shut the door, as opposed to having to buy (and maintain!)
furnitrue just to store books and hobby materials and so on - it's kind of
stupid IMO. And nonesense like "game areas" (i.e. open space they couldn't
figure out what the heck to do with) just adds insult to injury so to speak.

I saw a program profiling several Tokyo designers,a dn what I liked was that
walls weren't merely blank areas of nothing - walls were storage. MEaning,
teh room itself didn't need to be all clogged up with furniture that has to
be kept up with, because stuff was stored. The older I get (and the more
ovten I move), the more I've come to hate furniture.

The key overall to a smaller space is storage, and organization. I've been
in huge houses that "felt" small, becasue they were set up like rabbit-
warrens; conversely, one of the most comfortable and "large" place I've lived
was a 1500 sq ft house, becasue it had almost no hallways. Main thing was
that it was 2 storeys, so it did need stairs, but the area under then was
utilized (basement door) andthe overall floorplan was compact. OF course, it
also only had a bath and a half - most Americans these days seem to "need"
five bathrooms, and a master bath large enough to host a formal ball...


So that's the trick with smaller spaces - organization, and flow. Oh, and
quality materials ;)

- Kris

[RicodJour]

Post by Kris Krieger
THe interesting thing is how little useable room on egains with increased
square footage.  The rental house here was 2500 sq ft, and had a *huge*
amount of built-in storage.  THis place is 3200 sq ft, about the same closet
space, less kitchen cabinet space, and little additional storage (soem
shelves in the laundry room  is the extent of it).  The otehr, and even
stupider, thing is that the entire area under the stairs is simply walled off
- no access, no storage.  It's goofy.
If I can ever have a place custom-designed, I want to be sure it uincludes
lots of built-in storage.  I'd ratherput stuff into a cabinet or closet or
whatever, and shut the door, as opposed to having to buy (and maintain!)
furnitrue just to store books and hobby materials and so on - it's kind of
stupid IMO.  And nonesense like "game areas" (i.e. open space they couldn't
figure out what the heck to do with) just adds insult to injury so to speak.
I saw a program profiling several Tokyo designers,a dn what I liked was that
walls weren't merely blank areas of nothing - walls were storage.  MEaning,
teh room itself didn't need to be all clogged up with furniture that has to
be kept up with, because stuff was stored.  The older I get (and the more
ovten I move), the more I've come to hate furniture.
The key overall to a smaller space is storage, and organization.  I've been
in huge houses that "felt" small, becasue they were set up like rabbit-
warrens; conversely, one of the most comfortable and "large" place I've lived
was a 1500 sq ft house, becasue it had almost no hallways.  Main thing was
that it was 2 storeys, so it did need stairs, but the area under then was
utilized (basement door) andthe overall floorplan was compact.  OF course, it
also only had a bath and a half - most Americans these days seem to "need"
five bathrooms, and a master bath large enough to host a formal ball...  
So that's the trick with smaller spaces - organization, and flow.  Oh, and
quality materials ;)

Movable storage systems are interesting. You've seen them in
libraries and doctor's offices - there's no reason that similar, but
more attractive versions, couldn't be used in residential
construction.
http://www.storageessentials.com/shop/filing+and+file+storage|223/

One of the houses at the Solar Decathlon last year had a movable wall
between the bedroom area and the dining area. You rarely need both
spaces at the same time.

R

[Kris Krieger]

[snip]

Post by RicodJour

Post by Kris Krieger
So that's the trick with smaller spaces - organization, and flow.  Oh,

and

Post by Kris Krieger
quality materials ;)

Movable storage systems are interesting. You've seen them in
libraries and doctor's offices - there's no reason that similar, but
more attractive versions, couldn't be used in residential
construction.
http://www.storageessentials.com/shop/filing+and+file+storage|223/

Interesting - I'd meant "moveable" as in, move from one
house/city/state/country to another, however, that link opens some very
interesting posibilities - if the mechanism could be fitted with
materials/finishes more geared towards living areas, there are a great many
possibilities.

Post by RicodJour
One of the houses at the Solar Decathlon last year had a movable wall
between the bedroom area and the dining area. You rarely need both
spaces at the same time.
R

That could be interesting if the dining room is very rarely used, but ti'd
get annoying if one had to move itall every evening. Kind fo a mixed bag
but, like everything else, it depends upon one's lifestyle. Personally,
the last time I used a formal dining room as such was Decenmber of 1997 ;)

The whole idea of having a separate "formal" living room (which IMO ought
to be re-named "visitor room" or even the old "salon", because nobody
"lives", i.e. spends much time, in the "living room") are dicey in modest
homes, where the "formal" rooms end up being space that's almost never
used.


My personal preference would be to have some sort of mobile wall system
around the kitchen - I donlt likea continually-open one because grease,
noise,a nd odors jsut migrate too easily. So, I'd liket o be able to close
it off while cooking (and have a super-powerful fume hood - most don't pull
worth beans, *but* sound like a 747 at takeoff). If that could be done,
you'd only need an eating area, becasue if you had visitors, they wouldn't
have to go to the other end of the house so as to no look into the kitchen
while dining - put down flooring that loks nice but is easy to maintain
(i.e., *not* wall-to-wall carpeting), have a table/seating system that also
is fairly easy to maintain and therefor can be also used for things other
than just eating.


It just seems to me that there have got to be more adaptable solutions,
other than just having a humongous house with a lot of seldom-used spaces
that are very expensive to heat/cool.

ANyway, thanks for tthe moving-storage link, it's giving me some new ideas
;)

- kris

[Warm Worm]

Post by RicodJour

 > Did you ever look at sailboat's for design inspiration for

your house?  They're really clever about packing in storage and
keeping things stowed away.  

Boat-design as inspiration for small house design crossed my mind as
well. I wonder if architecture schools teach something of it.

Hell, most of them don't even reference working buildings for design.

Really?!

Post by RicodJour
I think Ken should have looked at some teardrop trailers for his house
design.
Poke around this page and you'll see what I
mean:http://teardrop.blogicalthoughts.com/td_2nditg.html
A teardrop design has all sorts of benefits in Ken's situation.  It is
DIY friendly, it has a cool sloping roof that sheds snow and water.
It's basically made for cooking/eating and lying down - Ken's favorite
activities.  It has a large opening rear hatch - perfect for after the
Spring thaw when the Grizzly bears have left the area.  It rolls so he
can move it around.  He could build several of them for when guests
and family visit and when he is in the dog house.  He could circle the
wagons when the restless natives are particularly restless.  It's
freaking aluminum and wood and how cool is that?!

Cool... or rather, in referring to your other post, wow...
It looks enough to make him
cry for a Teardrop...
Ok, it's early morning here and I haven't had
A nice Tazo Chai
yet (with ice and
Carnation evaporated milk)
and I'm a little more tired than usual because of my putting together
an
Ikea metal futon bed
last night,
which went without a hitch,
bitch.

...I should field companies and sell them ad-space within my posts
subtly and inconspicuously.

[KMK]

"Ken S. Tucker" <***@vianet.on.ca> wrote in news:7a8b4080-32bc-4df3-
86b4-***@k36g2000pri.googlegroups.com:

[snipped]

Post by Ken S. Tucker
Architecture has evolved fairly
well to keep things serviceable. In this place we
designed we kept "serviceability access" in priority
above appearance. We had a serious challenge as
we have no basement, not even crawl space, so
removeable panels were used.
Ken

SOmething I've been wondering for a while is a realted to under-floor heating
systems - usually, the tubes (that carry the hot waer) are embedded in
concrete when a foundation slab is poured, but, to make it more acessible if
repairs are needed, isn't there a way to use some larger hosing to either
(1) create a channel into which the actual hoses/piping could be laid, and
then have somewhat-raised flooring put on top,
or
(2) snake the hot-water hoses through the larger hoses/piping?


Just wondering.

[Pat]

Post by KMK
[snipped]

Post by Ken S. Tucker
Architecture has evolved fairly
well to keep things serviceable. In this place we
designed we kept "serviceability access" in priority
above appearance. We had a serious challenge as
we have no basement, not even crawl space, so
removeable panels were used.
Ken

SOmething I've been wondering for a while is a realted to under-floor heating
systems - usually, the tubes (that carry the hot waer) are embedded in
concrete when a foundation slab is poured, but, to make it more acessible if
repairs are needed, isn't there a way to use some larger hosing to either
(1) create a channel into which the actual hoses/piping could be laid, and
then have somewhat-raised flooring put on top,
or
(2) snake the hot-water hoses through the larger hoses/piping?
Just wondering.

If you're worried about that, you can install them between floor
joists -- that's how you heat the 2nd floor. That would give you
accessibility, so long as you are willing to tear up your floor. Or,
put in a basement so you can get at it from the bottom.

[KMK]

Post by Pat

Post by KMK
news:7a8b4080-32bc-4df3-
[snipped]

Post by Ken S. Tucker
Architecture has evolved fairly
well to keep things serviceable. In this place we
designed we kept "serviceability access" in priority
above appearance. We had a serious challenge as
we have no basement, not even crawl space, so
removeable panels were used.
Ken

SOmething I've been wondering for a while is a realted to under-floor
heating systems - usually, the tubes (that carry the hot waer) are
embedded in concrete when a foundation slab is poured, but, to make it
more acessible if repairs are needed, isn't there a way to use some
larger hosing to either (1) create a channel into which the actual
hoses/piping could be laid, and then have somewhat-raised flooring put
on top, or
(2) snake the hot-water hoses through the larger hoses/piping?
Just wondering.

If you're worried about that, you can install them between floor
joists -- that's how you heat the 2nd floor. That would give you
accessibility, so long as you are willing to tear up your floor. Or,
put in a basement so you can get at it from the bottom.

I never thought of in-floor heating on a second floor that isn't concrete (as
in a non-low-rise apartment building), to be honest - I've only ever seen it
embedded in concrete, so, if a repair has to be done, it's not just that the
floor has to be torn up, a concrete salb floor has to be torn up.

But I thought that, if a channel could be made in the concrete and the hot-
water hosing just laid in, and then if the floor on top could be on raised
panels (to insure there was no contact between the flooring and the hot
hosing/piping), then, if the system needed repair, there'd be no tearing at
all so to speak, you just lift up the floor panels.

Would that not work...?

- Kris

[Ken S. Tucker]

Post by KMK

Post by Pat

Post by KMK
news:7a8b4080-32bc-4df3-
[snipped]

Post by Ken S. Tucker
Architecture has evolved fairly
well to keep things serviceable. In this place we
designed we kept "serviceability access" in priority
above appearance. We had a serious challenge as
we have no basement, not even crawl space, so
removeable panels were used.
Ken

SOmething I've been wondering for a while is a realted to under-floor
heating systems - usually, the tubes (that carry the hot waer) are
embedded in concrete when a foundation slab is poured, but, to make it
more acessible if repairs are needed, isn't there a way to use some
larger hosing to either (1) create a channel into which the actual
hoses/piping could be laid, and then have somewhat-raised flooring put
on top, or
(2) snake the hot-water hoses through the larger hoses/piping?
Just wondering.

If you're worried about that, you can install them between floor
joists -- that's how you heat the 2nd floor. That would give you
accessibility, so long as you are willing to tear up your floor. Or,
put in a basement so you can get at it from the bottom.

I never thought of in-floor heating on a second floor that isn't concrete (as
in a non-low-rise apartment building), to be honest - I've only ever seen it
embedded in concrete, so, if a repair has to be done, it's not just that the
floor has to be torn up, a concrete salb floor has to be torn up.
But I thought that, if a channel could be made in the concrete and the hot-
water hosing just laid in, and then if the floor on top could be on raised
panels (to insure there was no contact between the flooring and the hot
hosing/piping), then, if the system needed repair, there'd be no tearing at
all so to speak, you just lift up the floor panels.
Would that not work...?
- Kris

A friend of ours put in air channeling ducts under
his basement floor right in the concrete, says it
works great. He's a pro contractor and everything
must be done to A+ standards.

Myself, I ran a 1" plastic water pipe from the cistern
inside 4" O-pipe to the house, buried about 18".
We went away for a couple of weeks in the winter
and - of course - temperatures plunged to near
record lows, and there was nil snow for insulation.
Not a prob for Mr. Tucker, he designed provision
for a hair dryer to push hot air into the O-pipe and
proceeds to thaw the pipe per SOP, except for one
minor detail...the hot air wouldn't flow. Hmm, WTF?

A fitting had a slow leak and filled the O-pipe with
water which froze! ....duh....forgot to put drain holes
in the bottom of the O-pipe. Anyway, don't worry,
were ok now :-).
Ken

[[e-mail]]

Post by Ken S. Tucker

Post by KMK

Post by Pat

Post by KMK
news:7a8b4080-32bc-4df3-
[snipped]

Post by Ken S. Tucker
Architecture has evolved fairly
well to keep things serviceable. In this place we
designed we kept "serviceability access" in priority
above appearance. We had a serious challenge as
we have no basement, not even crawl space, so
removeable panels were used.
Ken

SOmething I've been wondering for a while is a realted to under-floor
heating systems - usually, the tubes (that carry the hot waer) are
embedded in concrete when a foundation slab is poured, but, to make it
more acessible if repairs are needed, isn't there a way to use some
larger hosing to either (1) create a channel into which the actual
hoses/piping could be laid, and then have somewhat-raised flooring put
on top, or
(2) snake the hot-water hoses through the larger hoses/piping?
Just wondering.

If you're worried about that, you can install them between floor
joists -- that's how you heat the 2nd floor.  That would give you
accessibility, so long as you are willing to tear up your floor.  Or,
put in a basement so you can get at it from the bottom.

I never thought of in-floor heating on a second floor that isn't concrete (as
in a non-low-rise apartment building), to be honest - I've only ever seen it
embedded in concrete, so, if a repair has to be done, it's not just that the
floor has to be torn up, a concrete salb floor has to be torn up.
But I thought that, if a channel could be made in the concrete and the hot-
water hosing just laid in, and then if the floor on top could be on raised
panels (to insure there was no contact between the flooring and the hot
hosing/piping), then, if the system needed repair, there'd be no tearing at
all so to speak, you just lift up the floor panels.
Would that not work...?
- Kris

A friend of ours put in air channeling ducts under
his basement floor right in the concrete, says it
works great. He's a pro contractor and everything
must be done to A+ standards.
Myself, I ran a 1" plastic water pipe from the cistern
inside 4" O-pipe to the house, buried about 18".
We went away for a couple of weeks in the winter
and - of course - temperatures plunged to near
record lows, and there was nil snow for insulation.
 Not a prob for Mr. Tucker, he designed provision
for a hair dryer to push hot air into the O-pipe and
proceeds to thaw the pipe per SOP, except for one
minor detail...the hot air wouldn't flow. Hmm, WTF?
A fitting had a slow leak and filled the O-pipe with
water which froze! ....duh....forgot to put drain holes
in the bottom of the O-pipe. Anyway, don't worry,
were ok now :-).
Ken

The holes would have frozen too.
The solution was heat tape on a thermocouple and a solar panel with
battery.
Or, just bury the dam thing 4' down and be done with it.
I know, I know, Ditch Witch rental is $75/hr but when you wanna run
with the big dawgs......

[RicodJour]

Post by KMK

Post by Pat

Post by KMK
news:7a8b4080-32bc-4df3-
[snipped]

Post by Ken S. Tucker
Architecture has evolved fairly
well to keep things serviceable. In this place we
designed we kept "serviceability access" in priority
above appearance. We had a serious challenge as
we have no basement, not even crawl space, so
removeable panels were used.
Ken

SOmething I've been wondering for a while is a realted to under-floor
heating systems - usually, the tubes (that carry the hot waer) are
embedded in concrete when a foundation slab is poured, but, to make it
more acessible if repairs are needed, isn't there a way to use some
larger hosing to either (1) create a channel into which the actual
hoses/piping could be laid, and then have somewhat-raised flooring put
on top, or
(2) snake the hot-water hoses through the larger hoses/piping?
Just wondering.

If you're worried about that, you can install them between floor
joists -- that's how you heat the 2nd floor.  That would give you
accessibility, so long as you are willing to tear up your floor.  Or,
put in a basement so you can get at it from the bottom.

I never thought of in-floor heating on a second floor that isn't concrete (as
in a non-low-rise apartment building), to be honest - I've only ever seen it
embedded in concrete, so, if a repair has to be done, it's not just that the
floor has to be torn up, a concrete salb floor has to be torn up.
But I thought that, if a channel could be made in the concrete and the hot-
water hosing just laid in, and then if the floor on top could be on raised
panels (to insure there was no contact between the flooring and the hot
hosing/piping), then, if the system needed repair, there'd be no tearing at
all so to speak, you just lift up the floor panels.
Would that not work...?

Contact between the hot pipe and the concrete is how the heating
energy is transferred. Your system would cost more to operate as the
heat transfer would be less efficient.

Cutting open a slab and repairing some PEX would cost a grand or less,
and with thermal imaging locating the leak is not that difficult.
Your redundant piping idea would have some benefits, some
disadvantages and would cost more than a repair that might never need
to be done.

You are suggesting designing a system because you expect it to fail.

R

[[e-mail]]

Post by KMK
[snipped]

Post by Ken S. Tucker
Architecture has evolved fairly
well to keep things serviceable. In this place we
designed we kept "serviceability access" in priority
above appearance. We had a serious challenge as
we have no basement, not even crawl space, so
removeable panels were used.
Ken

SOmething I've been wondering for a while is a realted to under-floor heating
systems - usually, the tubes (that carry the hot waer) are embedded in
concrete when a foundation slab is poured, but, to make it more acessible if
repairs are needed, isn't there a way to use some larger hosing to either
(1) create a channel into which the actual hoses/piping could be laid, and
then have somewhat-raised flooring put on top,
or
(2) snake the hot-water hoses through the larger hoses/piping?
Just wondering.

Yes, it would *work* but not the way you want it to.
You are not considering the principle of radiant heat.

The PEX with hot water running though them heats the surrounding
cementitious material and after a spell continues to radiate the heat
into the room.
Radiant heat if different than the other forms of heat you are
probably more familiar with.

When the PEX is embedded inside the concrete it is effectively inside
a conduit, just like regular PVC water piping is.
If the pipe breaks, so what?, its inside another pipe made of
concrete.

When PEX is installed on a 2nd floor that is constructed of wood it is
secured to the wood subfloor with the proper channels and then a layer
of light weight concrete is poured over top, again, embedding the PEX
inside the concrete.

If you want to heat the air in a room a $20 space heater will do that,
but when it cycles off the air quickly cools.
If you want to heat the room and the things in the room that is where
radiant heat shows its stuff.

And then there's electric radiant floor heat but thats a whole nuther
animal.

[Jack May]

Post by Pat
I got me thinking, what God-forsaken person designed this. It takes
an hour to figure out how the make the repair and how to get into the
area I wanted to get into. Okay, it's not architecture, but it is
engineering and design. Grrrrrrrr.
2.5 hours to spin on the end of a speed cable. Ugh.

My first guess is that it is an Italian design. I once owned a Fiat X/19
mid engine sports car. It was extremely hard to get to anything to repair
or adjust. That was my lesson on why nobody should ever buy an Italian
vehicle of any type.

Motorcycles are very hard to design because they have to fit so much into
such a small space. It is like designing a 3D puzzle according to some
shows I have seen on TV.

[[e-mail]]

Post by Pat
A couple of days ago the speedo cable on my motorcycle came undone up
at the speedo end.  It just came undone and pulled out of the
speedo.
Now, on most bikes it's NBD, but I have an older, full-dress, touring
bike with complete flairings and more trim than you can imagine.
Removing the flairing is sometimes the hardest (and most time
consuming) part of the job.
After removing the flairing near where the gas tank is (okay, the gas
tank is actually under the seat, but it where it is on other bikes)
and the left-hand part of the dash, I couldn't get into the instrument
cluster -- let alone into the back of it.
I then started taking the windshield assembly off to get the headlight
out.  By removing the headline and the left blinker assembly, I could
sort of get into the area.  At least I could feel the threads on the
back of the speedo.  But there was no way to get my hands and the
cable up in there, get things properly aligned, and then spin on the
cable.
I finally got the spindle up in where it belonged, held it in place
through the blinker hole, and was able to spin the exterior of the
cable and get it to screw on.
I got me thinking, what God-forsaken person designed this.  It takes
an hour to figure out how the make the repair and how to get into the
area I wanted to get into.  Okay, it's not architecture, but it is
engineering and design.  Grrrrrrrr.
 2.5 hours to spin on the end of a speed cable.  Ugh.

The fairing acted like Fort Knox, which then made your speedometer
gold bullion.
When you put it back on I hope you wrapped some teflon tape around it
or a couple drops of Loctite otherwise whatever made it unthread the
first time will do it again.
Spending 2.5 hours doing something is an investment, if its done
right.
Spending 2.5 hours the 2nd time is a waste......

[Warm Worm]

Post by Pat
A couple of days ago the speedo cable on my motorcycle came undone up
at the speedo end.  It just came undone and pulled out of the
speedo.
Now, on most bikes it's NBD, but I have an older, full-dress, touring
bike with complete flairings and more trim than you can imagine.
Removing the flairing is sometimes the hardest (and most time
consuming) part of the job.

What's NBD; and are you talking about the fairing;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motorcycle_fairing ?

Post by Pat
After removing the flairing near where the gas tank is (okay, the gas
tank is actually under the seat, but it where it is on other bikes)
and the left-hand part of the dash, I couldn't get into the instrument
cluster -- let alone into the back of it.
I then started taking the windshield assembly off to get the headlight
out.  By removing the headline and the left blinker assembly, I could
sort of get into the area.  At least I could feel the threads on the
back of the speedo.  But there was no way to get my hands and the
cable up in there, get things properly aligned, and then spin on the
cable.
I finally got the spindle up in where it belonged, held it in place
through the blinker hole, and was able to spin the exterior of the
cable and get it to screw on.
I got me thinking, what God-forsaken person designed this.  It takes
an hour to figure out how the make the repair and how to get into the
area I wanted to get into.  Okay, it's not architecture, but it is
engineering and design.  Grrrrrrrr.

Any biker that misspells fairing needs to have a good workout with
one. ;)

Post by Pat
 2.5 hours to spin on the end of a speed cable.  Ugh.

Good stuff.

[Warm Worm]

Post by Pat
A couple of days ago the speedo cable on my motorcycle came undone up
at the speedo end.  It just came undone and pulled out of the
speedo.
Now, on most bikes it's NBD, but I have an older, full-dress, touring
bike with complete flairings and more trim than you can imagine.
Removing the flairing is sometimes the hardest (and most time
consuming) part of the job.

What's NBD; and are you talking about the fairing;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motorcycle_fairing ?

Post by Pat
After removing the flairing near where the gas tank is (okay, the gas
tank is actually under the seat, but it where it is on other bikes)
and the left-hand part of the dash, I couldn't get into the instrument
cluster -- let alone into the back of it.
I then started taking the windshield assembly off to get the headlight
out.  By removing the headline and the left blinker assembly, I could
sort of get into the area.  At least I could feel the threads on the
back of the speedo.  But there was no way to get my hands and the
cable up in there, get things properly aligned, and then spin on the
cable.
I finally got the spindle up in where it belonged, held it in place
through the blinker hole, and was able to spin the exterior of the
cable and get it to screw on.
I got me thinking, what God-forsaken person designed this.  It takes
an hour to figure out how the make the repair and how to get into the
area I wanted to get into.  Okay, it's not architecture, but it is
engineering and design.  Grrrrrrrr.

Any biker that misspells fairing needs to have a good workout with
one. ;)

Post by Pat
 2.5 hours to spin on the end of a speed cable.  Ugh.

Good stuff.

Here's a better one with a wraparound fairing:

Das ist good, ya?

[Pat]

Post by Pat
A couple of days ago the speedo cable on my motorcycle came undone up
at the speedo end. It just came undone and pulled out of the
speedo.
Now, on most bikes it's NBD, but I have an older, full-dress, touring
bike with complete flairings and more trim than you can imagine.
Removing the flairing is sometimes the hardest (and most time
consuming) part of the job.
After removing the flairing near where the gas tank is (okay, the gas
tank is actually under the seat, but it where it is on other bikes)
and the left-hand part of the dash, I couldn't get into the instrument
cluster -- let alone into the back of it.
I then started taking the windshield assembly off to get the headlight
out. By removing the headline and the left blinker assembly, I could
sort of get into the area. At least I could feel the threads on the
back of the speedo. But there was no way to get my hands and the
cable up in there, get things properly aligned, and then spin on the
cable.
I finally got the spindle up in where it belonged, held it in place
through the blinker hole, and was able to spin the exterior of the
cable and get it to screw on.
I got me thinking, what God-forsaken person designed this. It takes
an hour to figure out how the make the repair and how to get into the
area I wanted to get into. Okay, it's not architecture, but it is
engineering and design. Grrrrrrrr.
2.5 hours to spin on the end of a speed cable. Ugh.

I was watching the closing ceremonies of the Olympics. There's
something "wrong" with the flags. In an indoor stadium, they all flew
straight out and in the same direction. When the British flag was
raised, it wasn't out at all until it got to the top. Then, on cue,
it became fully extended.

They must be using some sort of air system inside the flag pole to
blow the flags out, so they don't droop. I've never heard of such a
thing. Pretty neat idea.

[Amy Blankenship]

Post by Pat
I was watching the closing ceremonies of the Olympics. There's
something "wrong" with the flags. In an indoor stadium, they all flew
straight out and in the same direction. When the British flag was
raised, it wasn't out at all until it got to the top. Then, on cue,
it became fully extended.
They must be using some sort of air system inside the flag pole to
blow the flags out, so they don't droop. I've never heard of such a
thing. Pretty neat idea.

I think car dealerships with giant flags have been doing that for years.

[Warm Worm]

On Aug 24, 7:00 pm, "Amy Blankenship"

Post by Amy Blankenship

I was watching the closing ceremonies of the Olympics.  There's
something "wrong" with the flags.  In an indoor stadium, they all flew
straight out and in the same direction.  When the British flag was
raised, it wasn't out at all until it got to the top.  Then, on cue,
it became fully extended.
They must be using some sort of air system inside the flag pole to
blow the flags out, so they don't droop.  I've never heard of such a
thing.  Pretty neat idea.

I think car dealerships with giant flags have been doing that for years.

Hey cutie-pie, how've you been?