Culture

[William]

Trying to avoid being cliché, please give me your definition of
Culture. Now our definitions of this loaded word will be different,
but put them all together and I think we will get a good picture of
them.

--(I realize my definitions will be a lot more fancy shmancy and
more complex then most people here living in Minneapolis)

Culture
--------------------
Heres a few local Minneapolis pictures to describe what I think of it.
(Going to these places with family, friends is implied)

---Here's the lake I pass by every day on the way to work. A lot
of times my family goes here for concerts such as the Minnesota
Orchestra.
Loading Image...

----Heres a shot from our sculpture garden
Loading Image...

----A shot of the new Guthrie Loading Image...

(I can't stress enough going here with family/friends is implied. For
me
I love hearing my older brother who works in city hall now talk all
about the latest cool things in Minneapolis. Its kind of hard to
explain it but just trust me
that I'm not a heartless robot)

[William]

Also my brother knows a lot about Minneapolis's history
of being The Mill City. Here is the picture of a part of the Mill city
musume Ruins
Loading Image...

[Amy Blankenship]

"William" <***@gmail.com> wrote in message news:***@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
Trying to avoid being cliché, please give me your definition of
Culture. Now our definitions of this loaded word will be different,
but put them all together and I think we will get a good picture of
them.


Yogurt.

[Pat]

On Jun 22, 10:46 am, "Amy Blankenship"

Post by William
Trying to avoid being cliché, please give me your definition of
Culture. Now our definitions of this loaded word will be different,
but put them all together and I think we will get a good picture of
them.
Yogurt.

Culture is your heritage. It is your past. It is where you came
from.

If you are Irish and you eat corned beef, that is cultural. If you
are not Irish, it is just food.

If you are some snotty, rich, upper class person who's family has
always went to the opera, that might be part of your culture. But for
most, it is not. It is entertainment.

The arts are separate. They are the arts. Walking through a sculpure
garden might expose your to art, but not to culture. Ancient masters
might be cultural though, because they are a legacy of the past.

What the government tries to do is pervert the definition of culture
so it can support entertainment for rich, white folks and their
favorite form of entertainment. oh, let's support the opera. They
use culture as an excuse, but it isn't culture. It is recreation,
entertainment, and tourism -- but it isn't culture.

Ponder a few things and then report back
Why is polo "culture" but football isn't.
Why is opera culture but Nine Inch Nails isn't
Why is sumo wrestling cultural, but WWF isn't.
Why is a coffee house cultural, but McDonald's isn't.

If you don't see a class and wealth factor to it, then .......

[William]

Post by Pat
On Jun 22, 10:46 am, "Amy Blankenship"

Post by William
Trying to avoid being cliché, please give me your definition of
Culture. Now our definitions of this loaded word will be different,
but put them all together and I think we will get a good picture of
them.
Yogurt.

Culture is your heritage. It is your past. It is where you came
from.
If you are Irish and you eat corned beef, that is cultural. If you
are not Irish, it is just food.
If you are some snotty, rich, upper class person who's family has
always went to the opera, that might be part of your culture. But for
most, it is not. It is entertainment.
The arts are separate. They are the arts. Walking through a sculpure
garden might expose your to art, but not to culture. Ancient masters
might be cultural though, because they are a legacy of the past.
What the government tries to do is pervert the definition of culture
so it can support entertainment for rich, white folks and their
favorite form of entertainment. oh, let's support the opera. They
use culture as an excuse, but it isn't culture. It is recreation,
entertainment, and tourism -- but it isn't culture.
Ponder a few things and then report back
Why is polo "culture" but football isn't.
Why is opera culture but Nine Inch Nails isn't
Why is sumo wrestling cultural, but WWF isn't.
Why is a coffee house cultural, but McDonald's isn't.
If you don't see a class and wealth factor to it, then .......

Well I guess Im using it in a different sense, by culture I guess I
mean exposing yourself to
something new, and different. Having an open mind. I just have this
image of a white middle to upper class kid from the suburb going
around listing to the All-American rejects while talking about
something and every five seconds the phrase "Thats Gay" comes into his
conversation.

White suburban Kid #1:Dude lets go hang out at Denny's. #2:No dude
theres that one bitchy waiter who yelled at us just because we were
talking to loud. #1:Thats Gay. #2 Yea it was some dumbass Asin lady.
#1: Stupid Japs.
Cough* White America Cough*

[george conklin]

"William" <***@gmail.com> wrote in message news:***@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
Trying to avoid being cliché, please give me your definition of
Culture. Now our definitions of this loaded word will be different,
but put them all together and I think we will get a good picture of
them.

--(
Any basic anthropology books has dozens. Look up a few.

B. F. Skinner used to say to his classes that a single satellite could
provide good cultural opportunities in small communities. Well, we have
that now.

[Pat]

Post by William
Trying to avoid being cliché, please give me your definition of
Culture. Now our definitions of this loaded word will be different,
but put them all together and I think we will get a good picture of
them.
--(I realize my definitions will be a lot more fancy shmancy and
more complex then most people here living in Minneapolis)
Culture
--------------------
Heres a few local Minneapolis pictures to describe what I think of it.
(Going to these places with family, friends is implied)
---Here's the lake I pass by every day on the way to work. A lot
of times my family goes here for concerts such as the Minnesota
Orchestra.http://www.photopixels.com/portraits/images/Lake%20Harriet%20artist.jpg
----Heres a shot from our sculpture gardenhttp://email.mtsd.k12.wi.us/~ddiener/vac/vac-Images/4.jpg
----A shot of the new Guthriehttp://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/07/04/arts/nouv.600.jpg
(I can't stress enough going here with family/friends is implied. For
me
I love hearing my older brother who works in city hall now talk all
about the latest cool things in Minneapolis. Its kind of hard to
explain it but just trust me
that I'm not a heartless robot)

Bill. Just got back from a youth lacrosse game -- 4 games actually.
The local tribal team vs. the Tuscarora team. Both are Iroquois. The
ages 6 to 16. Good turnout.

Tomorrow, the Royal Shakespeare Opera & Dance Company will be in the
next town to the north, as part of their North American Tour. That
town is a ski/golf resort that caters to rich, white folks.

Here's my question for you. Which of these events is "culture" and
why?

[William]

Post by Pat

Post by William
Trying to avoid being cliché, please give me your definition of
Culture. Now our definitions of this loaded word will be different,
but put them all together and I think we will get a good picture of
them.
--(I realize my definitions will be a lot more fancy shmancy and
more complex then most people here living in Minneapolis)
Culture
--------------------
Heres a few local Minneapolis pictures to describe what I think of it.
(Going to these places with family, friends is implied)
---Here's the lake I pass by every day on the way to work. A lot
of times my family goes here for concerts such as the Minnesota
Orchestra.http://www.photopixels.com/portraits/images/Lake%20Harriet%20artist.jpg
----Heres a shot from our sculpture gardenhttp://email.mtsd.k12.wi.us/~ddiener/vac/vac-Images/4.jpg
----A shot of the new Guthriehttp://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/07/04/arts/nouv.600.jpg
(I can't stress enough going here with family/friends is implied. For
me
I love hearing my older brother who works in city hall now talk all
about the latest cool things in Minneapolis. Its kind of hard to
explain it but just trust me
that I'm not a heartless robot)

Bill. Just got back from a youth lacrosse game -- 4 games actually.
The local tribal team vs. the Tuscarora team. Both are Iroquois. The
ages 6 to 16. Good turnout.
Tomorrow, the Royal Shakespeare Opera & Dance Company will be in the
next town to the north, as part of their North American Tour. That
town is a ski/golf resort that caters to rich, white folks.
Here's my question for you. Which of these events is "culture" and
why?

Which ever one is more foreign to you. If the kid who plays Lacrosse
looks at the Opera and says
wow thats gay, and then the rich white snooty kid looks at Lacrosse
and says something like " O those stupid boys soiling there outfits!"
There theres no culture, at least in the why I'm meaning it. For there
to be culture there has to be a cross unity between to different kinds
of life styles.

[William]

O yea also heres a display of a shirt I'm going to get at this store
called the fifth element
in Uptown. I think I might get the blue one or black one.
http://rep612.com/1heart.htm
(also just in case you look around the site more, 612 is Minneapoli's
area code. Our local underground
hip hop rapper sorta made it famous. (Aways coming back home to you-
Atmosphere)
It describeds most of my love for Minneapolis, its two songs in one.

[Pat]

Post by William

Post by Pat

Post by William
Trying to avoid being cliché, please give me your definition of
Culture. Now our definitions of this loaded word will be different,
but put them all together and I think we will get a good picture of
them.
--(I realize my definitions will be a lot more fancy shmancy and
more complex then most people here living in Minneapolis)
Culture
--------------------
Heres a few local Minneapolis pictures to describe what I think of it.
(Going to these places with family, friends is implied)
---Here's the lake I pass by every day on the way to work. A lot
of times my family goes here for concerts such as the Minnesota
Orchestra.http://www.photopixels.com/portraits/images/Lake%20Harriet%20artist.jpg
----Heres a shot from our sculpture gardenhttp://email.mtsd.k12.wi.us/~ddiener/vac/vac-Images/4.jpg
----A shot of the new Guthriehttp://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/07/04/arts/nouv.600.jpg
(I can't stress enough going here with family/friends is implied. For
me
I love hearing my older brother who works in city hall now talk all
about the latest cool things in Minneapolis. Its kind of hard to
explain it but just trust me
that I'm not a heartless robot)

Bill. Just got back from a youth lacrosse game -- 4 games actually.
The local tribal team vs. the Tuscarora team. Both are Iroquois. The
ages 6 to 16. Good turnout.
Tomorrow, the Royal Shakespeare Opera & Dance Company will be in the
next town to the north, as part of their North American Tour. That
town is a ski/golf resort that caters to rich, white folks.
Here's my question for you. Which of these events is "culture" and
why?

Which ever one is more foreign to you. If the kid who plays Lacrosse
looks at the Opera and says
wow thats gay, and then the rich white snooty kid looks at Lacrosse
and says something like " O those stupid boys soiling there outfits!"
There theres no culture, at least in the why I'm meaning it.

For there

Post by William
to be culture there has to be a cross unity between to different kinds
of life styles.

What the heck does that mean???????????

[William]

Post by William

Post by William

Post by Pat

Post by William
Trying to avoid being cliché, please give me your definition of
Culture. Now our definitions of this loaded word will be different,
but put them all together and I think we will get a good picture of
them.
--(I realize my definitions will be a lot more fancy shmancy and
more complex then most people here living in Minneapolis)
Culture
--------------------
Heres a few local Minneapolis pictures to describe what I think of it.
(Going to these places with family, friends is implied)
---Here's the lake I pass by every day on the way to work. A lot
of times my family goes here for concerts such as the Minnesota
Orchestra.http://www.photopixels.com/portraits/images/Lake%20Harriet%20artist.jpg
----Heres a shot from our sculpture gardenhttp://email.mtsd.k12.wi.us/~ddiener/vac/vac-Images/4.jpg
----A shot of the new Guthriehttp://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/07/04/arts/nouv.600.jpg
(I can't stress enough going here with family/friends is implied. For
me
I love hearing my older brother who works in city hall now talk all
about the latest cool things in Minneapolis. Its kind of hard to
explain it but just trust me
that I'm not a heartless robot)

Bill. Just got back from a youth lacrosse game -- 4 games actually.
The local tribal team vs. the Tuscarora team. Both are Iroquois. The
ages 6 to 16. Good turnout.
Tomorrow, the Royal Shakespeare Opera & Dance Company will be in the
next town to the north, as part of their North American Tour. That
town is a ski/golf resort that caters to rich, white folks.
Here's my question for you. Which of these events is "culture" and
why?

Which ever one is more foreign to you. If the kid who plays Lacrosse
looks at the Opera and says
wow thats gay, and then the rich white snooty kid looks at Lacrosse
and says something like " O those stupid boys soiling there outfits!"
There theres no culture, at least in the why I'm meaning it.

For there

Post by William
to be culture there has to be a cross unity between to different

kinds

Post by William
of life styles.

What the heck does that mean???????????

It means that the white kids from the burbs need to go and enjoy
a concert at the banshell at lake Harriet, and go to Sunny's the
local
Ice Cream shop so they will know what real ice cream tastes like and
not there Dairy queen.
Or another example would be the National Night out, in Minneapolis
we have the largest attending record, and on that night our whole
block gets together and has a Barbaque. Blacks,whites, Asians all
together talking with each other. Different races and cultures
blending together.

[george conklin]

Post by William
Trying to avoid being cliché, please give me your definition of
Culture. Now our definitions of this loaded word will be different,
but put them all together and I think we will get a good picture of
them.
--(I realize my definitions will be a lot more fancy shmancy and
more complex then most people here living in Minneapolis)
Culture
--------------------
Heres a few local Minneapolis pictures to describe what I think of it.
(Going to these places with family, friends is implied)
---Here's the lake I pass by every day on the way to work. A lot
of times my family goes here for concerts such as the Minnesota
Orchestra.http://www.photopixels.com/portraits/images/Lake%20Harriet%20artist.jpg
----Heres a shot from our sculpture
gardenhttp://email.mtsd.k12.wi.us/~ddiener/vac/vac-Images/4.jpg
----A shot of the new
Guthriehttp://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/07/04/arts/nouv.600.jpg
(I can't stress enough going here with family/friends is implied. For
me
I love hearing my older brother who works in city hall now talk all
about the latest cool things in Minneapolis. Its kind of hard to
explain it but just trust me
that I'm not a heartless robot)

Bill. Just got back from a youth lacrosse game -- 4 games actually.
The local tribal team vs. the Tuscarora team. Both are Iroquois. The
ages 6 to 16. Good turnout.

Tomorrow, the Royal Shakespeare Opera & Dance Company will be in the
next town to the north, as part of their North American Tour. That
town is a ski/golf resort that caters to rich, white folks.

Here's my question for you. Which of these events is "culture" and
why?

Culture with a Captial "C" is what Shakespeare is all about. I just saw
the Tempest and it was hard to understand and hard to follow. But it was
written 400 years ago, so I wonder what "The Sopranos" will be like in 400
years.

Culture with a small "c" is what we all possess and what we all produce.

[Pat]

Post by Pat

Post by William
Trying to avoid being cliché, please give me your definition of
Culture. Now our definitions of this loaded word will be different,
but put them all together and I think we will get a good picture of
them.
--(I realize my definitions will be a lot more fancy shmancy and
more complex then most people here living in Minneapolis)
Culture
--------------------
Heres a few local Minneapolis pictures to describe what I think of it.
(Going to these places with family, friends is implied)
---Here's the lake I pass by every day on the way to work. A lot
of times my family goes here for concerts such as the Minnesota
Orchestra.http://www.photopixels.com/portraits/images/Lake%20Harriet%20artist.jpg
----Heres a shot from our sculpture
gardenhttp://email.mtsd.k12.wi.us/~ddiener/vac/vac-Images/4.jpg
----A shot of the new
Guthriehttp://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/07/04/arts/nouv.600.jpg
(I can't stress enough going here with family/friends is implied. For
me
I love hearing my older brother who works in city hall now talk all
about the latest cool things in Minneapolis. Its kind of hard to
explain it but just trust me
that I'm not a heartless robot)

Bill. Just got back from a youth lacrosse game -- 4 games actually.
The local tribal team vs. the Tuscarora team. Both are Iroquois. The
ages 6 to 16. Good turnout.
Tomorrow, the Royal Shakespeare Opera & Dance Company will be in the
next town to the north, as part of their North American Tour. That
town is a ski/golf resort that caters to rich, white folks.
Here's my question for you. Which of these events is "culture" and
why?
Culture with a Captial "C" is what Shakespeare is all about. I just saw
the Tempest and it was hard to understand and hard to follow. But it was
written 400 years ago, so I wonder what "The Sopranos" will be like in 400
years.
Culture with a small "c" is what we all possess and what we all produce.

No, George, again you are totally wrong.

It is entertainment. It is snobbish, racially-motivated entertainment
aimed at old, rich, white folk. It is rich white government types
using public funding to support entertainment for other rich, white
folk who then feel morally, socially, and personally superior because
they are watching something written by some old, dead, white guy. It
is arrogance to think of it as anything other than entertainment. The
sole item you are right about is that it is no "better" than the
Sopranos, nor worse.

The goverment supports entertainment for rich, white people because
that's who runs the government. The entertainemnt of the rank-and-
file needs to operate without government support and the rich, white,
arrogant guys think it is therefore some lesser thing.

You have fallen into that whole "entertainment as culture" thing, just
like William.

It is not "culture" or "Culture", it is arrogance.

George, you have a lot of education but you don't know very much.

[William]

Post by Pat
No, George, again you are totally wrong.
It is entertainment. It is snobbish, racially-motivated entertainment
aimed at old, rich, white folk. It is rich white government types
using public funding to support entertainment for other rich, white
folk who then feel morally, socially, and personally superior because
they are watching something written by some old, dead, white guy.

Yea Beethoven what an idiot right? Our Pop Culture is so much
less commercilized then that stupid Baroque era. American Idol is so
much better then seeing one of the smartest man alive play some
retarted instrument!

There called "Fine Arts" for a reason Pat. There a lot harder
to preform then most things people like to do now.

It is arrogance to think of it as anything other than
entertainment. The

Post by Pat
sole item you are right about is that it is no "better" than the
Sopranos, nor worse.

So 50 cent's "P.I.M.P" or Dr.Dre's "Bitches an't shit" are just as
good as Antonio Vivaldi's The four seasons?

Post by Pat
The goverment supports entertainment for rich, white people because
that's who runs the government. The entertainemnt of the rank-and-
file needs to operate without government support and the rich, white,
arrogant guys think it is therefore some lesser thing.
You have fallen into that whole "entertainment as culture" thing, just
like William.

You got to realize that all the places I talk about here would not be
fun at all
if my family or friends weren't with me. Theres more to culture then
hanging with your family at the park. I mean thats a lot of it but
culture is some what made up of the material world. What would
Italians be without there food? What would the whole world except the
U.S. be without Football (soccer)?

Post by Pat
It is not "culture" or "Culture", it is arrogance.

You wanna know a group of people who have a sweet culture? The
Catholic Mexicans on
my block who go to my chruch. (Yea I'm Catholic) Every Sunday they go
to Church with each other, then after they go to the park, play some
soccer and Bar-Ba-que some steaks or Hamburgers. No gangs, no latin
kings, just family and friends.


Who do you think is smarter, some "women" who does
nothing in her life but lives of her mommy and daddy's pay check and
still manages to go to jail or some dead white guy who wrote music
that nobody in a million years could even attempt at?

[William]

Some of the lyrics from Dr.Dre's "Bitches an't shit"

"I used to know a bitch named Eric Wright
We used to roll around and fuck the hoes at night
Tight than a mutharfucka with the gangsta beats
And we was ballin' on the muthafuckin' Compton streets
Peep, the shit got deep and it was on
Number 1 song after number 1 song
Long as my muthafuckin' pockets was fat
I didn't give a fuck where the bitch was at
But she was hangin' with a white bitch doin' the shit she do
Suckin' on his dick just to get a buck or 2
And the few ends she got didn't mean nothin'
Now she's suing cuz the shit she be doin' ain't shit
Bitch can't hang with the streets, she found herself short"

The Third Concerto

Loading Image...

[Pat]

Post by William
Some of the lyrics from Dr.Dre's "Bitches an't shit"
"I used to know a bitch named Eric Wright
We used to roll around and fuck the hoes at night
Tight than a mutharfucka with the gangsta beats
And we was ballin' on the muthafuckin' Compton streets
Peep, the shit got deep and it was on
Number 1 song after number 1 song
Long as my muthafuckin' pockets was fat
I didn't give a fuck where the bitch was at
But she was hangin' with a white bitch doin' the shit she do
Suckin' on his dick just to get a buck or 2
And the few ends she got didn't mean nothin'
Now she's suing cuz the shit she be doin' ain't shit
Bitch can't hang with the streets, she found herself short"

T'was Greek he spoke and t'was Greek to me.

Ever read untranslated Shakespeare or Beowulf? What you read isn't
what either of those guys wrote. You are reading something some
college professor wrote and says it is more-or-less what the bard
said.

Post by William
The Third Concerto
http://www.musicroom.com/images/catalogue/samples/FTR81.jpg

[William]

Post by Pat
T'was Greek he spoke and t'was Greek to me.
Ever read untranslated Shakespeare or Beowulf? What you read isn't
what either of those guys wrote. You are reading something some
college professor wrote and says it is more-or-less what the bard
said.

You realize the English version of the bible was'nt written by
Mathew,Mark,Luke,John etc either right?

[William]

Post by Pat
T'was Greek he spoke and t'was Greek to me.
Ever read untranslated Shakespeare or Beowulf? What you read isn't
what either of those guys wrote. You are reading something some
college professor wrote and says it is more-or-less what the bard
said.

You realize the English version of the bible was not written by
its original writers either right?

[Amy Blankenship]

Post by William

Post by Pat
T'was Greek he spoke and t'was Greek to me.
Ever read untranslated Shakespeare or Beowulf? What you read isn't
what either of those guys wrote. You are reading something some
college professor wrote and says it is more-or-less what the bard
said.

You realize the English version of the bible was not written by
its original writers either right?

One reason why Muslims insist on learning the Koran in Arabic.

[Pat]

On Jun 25, 1:28 pm, "Amy Blankenship"

Post by Amy Blankenship

Post by William

Post by Pat
T'was Greek he spoke and t'was Greek to me.
Ever read untranslated Shakespeare or Beowulf? What you read isn't
what either of those guys wrote. You are reading something some
college professor wrote and says it is more-or-less what the bard
said.

You realize the English version of the bible was not written by
its original writers either right?

One reason why Muslims insist on learning the Koran in Arabic.

Plus, then you don't have the whole Apocrypha fiasco.

[Pat]

Post by William

Post by Pat
T'was Greek he spoke and t'was Greek to me.
Ever read untranslated Shakespeare or Beowulf? What you read isn't
what either of those guys wrote. You are reading something some
college professor wrote and says it is more-or-less what the bard
said.

You realize the English version of the bible was not written by
its original writers either right?

Yes, my Catholic friend. That is why there are vastly different
biblical traditions between Catholics and protestants -- especially
"Born Agains".

Many Evangelicals believe in the literal interpretation of the bible
whereas Catholics have always believe in interpreting it (maybe
interpreting it to excess). That is also why tradition of Bulls have
played such a strong roll in Catholicisms.

But there is also a love of the arts. Much of the fine arts, or what
you would call "culture") is based in Catholism. A lot of classical
music comes from masses and a lot of art is religously inspired.

So maybe some of that is within your culture, because a lot of it is
within your religion ... but I am more from the Irish, beer-swilling
Catholic tradition.

Let me refine my previous point. I see nothing wrong with Shakespeare
or Brahms or anyone else. I just don't think it is superior because
it is by dead, white guys and because other dead, white guys say they
like it. Actually, I don't really mind that the only way that it can
survive is through massive public subsidies.

What I do mind is that SOOOOOOO many people THINK it is better because
they are old white people and they think that THEY are better because
they listen too it, or see the plays, etc. etc.

So don't go all Shakespearean on me. You were they guy advocating
graffiti as art. If you remember, I said I didn't have trouble with
it as long as it was on YOUR building, not mine because otherwise it
was vandalism. Well that also applies to Michelangeo. If he came
back and painted on my building, that too would be vandalism (it would
also be incredible but that's another thread). The difference isn't
the "quality", it is the intent, ownership, and permission. I also
sent you the link on that Julian dude who draws on the sidewalks.
He's incredible.

The problem isn't with fine arts or "common" art. It is with the
arrogance that comes with thinking some people and/or things are
better because of their exposure to it, upbringing, money, race, etc.
etec.

[Amy Blankenship]

Post by Pat

Post by William

Post by Pat
T'was Greek he spoke and t'was Greek to me.
Ever read untranslated Shakespeare or Beowulf? What you read isn't
what either of those guys wrote. You are reading something some
college professor wrote and says it is more-or-less what the bard
said.

You realize the English version of the bible was not written by
its original writers either right?

Yes, my Catholic friend. That is why there are vastly different
biblical traditions between Catholics and protestants -- especially
"Born Agains".
Many Evangelicals believe in the literal interpretation of the bible
whereas Catholics have always believe in interpreting it (maybe
interpreting it to excess). That is also why tradition of Bulls have
played such a strong roll in Catholicisms.

No, bulls have played such a strong role in Catholicism because they were
part of the worship of a people that was absorbed into Catholicism. It's
the same reason that Easter is named after a pagan goddess and is associated
with rabbits.

[William]

Post by Pat

Post by William

Post by Pat
T'was Greek he spoke and t'was Greek to me.
Ever read untranslated Shakespeare or Beowulf? What you read isn't
what either of those guys wrote. You are reading something some
college professor wrote and says it is more-or-less what the bard
said.

You realize the English version of the bible was not written by
its original writers either right?

Yes, my Catholic friend. That is why there are vastly different
biblical traditions between Catholics and protestants -- especially
"Born Agains".
Many Evangelicals believe in the literal interpretation of the bible
whereas Catholics have always believe in interpreting it (maybe
interpreting it to excess). That is also why tradition of Bulls have
played such a strong roll in Catholicisms.
But there is also a love of the arts. Much of the fine arts, or what
you would call "culture") is based in Catholism. A lot of classical
music comes from masses and a lot of art is religously inspired.
So maybe some of that is within your culture, because a lot of it is
within your religion ... but I am more from the Irish, beer-swilling
Catholic tradition.
Let me refine my previous point. I see nothing wrong with Shakespeare
or Brahms or anyone else. I just don't think it is superior because
it is by dead, white guys and because other dead, white guys say they
like it. Actually, I don't really mind that the only way that it can
survive is through massive public subsidies.

So your saying just because its old and is known as a
"classic" doesent mean
its better then anything other kind of entertainment. Now I see your
point more clearly and I'll have to agree with that.

Post by Pat
What I do mind is that SOOOOOOO many people THINK it is better because
they are old white people and they think that THEY are better because
they listen too it, or see the plays, etc. etc.

Sounds like something George would do....

Post by Pat
So don't go all Shakespearean on me. You were they guy advocating
graffiti as art. If you remember, I said I didn't have trouble with
it as long as it was on YOUR building, not mine because otherwise it
was vandalism. Well that also applies to Michelangeo. If he came
back and painted on my building, that too would be vandalism (it would
also be incredible but that's another thread). The difference isn't
the "quality", it is the intent, ownership, and permission. I also
sent you the link on that Julian dude who draws on the sidewalks.
He's incredible.
The problem isn't with fine arts or "common" art. It is with the
arrogance that comes with thinking some people and/or things are
better because of their exposure to it, upbringing, money, race, etc.
etec.

Sounds good, I see your opinion much more clearly know and I'll
have to agree with you.

[drydem]

Post by William
Trying to avoid being cliché, please give me your definition of
Culture. Now our definitions of this loaded word will be different,
but put them all together and I think we will get a good picture of
them.

Culture

1. The method(functional controls) of communication within a society
( e.g. language, music, physical gesture, art) which operate/affect
those things/objects which form that society's identity (e.g. social
norms, beliefs, rituals, cusine).

2. The social phenomena of the interaction, blending, participation
of, and/or independently co-existence of uniquely different social
groups(cultures) in one physical region/spot.

3. The psychological phenomena of being able to absorb, integrate/
assimilate, participate effectively with, and appreciate uniquely
different social groups(cultures).